It's true. At one point in my life I was a "nice guy." I tried to be kind and caring. I listened to people's problems and pointless ramblings for hours on end because I knew they just wanted to talk. I was always to the first to sacrifice things I wanted to do for the sake of another.


I did all these things, not to get women, not because I had been taught to but because that was who I was. I'm not that guy anymore. Oh sure, I will still listen to the problems of my friends, but I would really like them to get to the point. I am not outwardly mean or cruel. I will still open the door for you if your hands are full. But I am not a Nice Guy.

Very little happens without a reason, especially when changing a personality. I used to think that women would like a guy who was.. well ... nice. Oh, was I wrong! They don't want you as a relationship, they keep you on the back burner. They come to you to bitch about how the fucking asshole they are with is giving them shit. You get to hear about how he treats them like dirt, but they put up with it because, "He's so cute!" Screw that.

From all of my time as "The Friend" and being The Nice Guy I have come to a conclusion: Women LIKE assholes! Hey, don't get pissed at me. Oh sure, women will always bitch and moan about how their dickhead boyfriend is not treating them right and how much they would love to meet a nice guy. Then the chance comes for them to make that change. They have finally been dumped by the asswipe and are looking for a new relationship.
And what type of guy to the ultimately choose? Another asshole.

This is simple training. Oh yes, I have been trained; I have learned. Women have taught me one thing. That they LIKE assholes! They like being treated like shit. They LIKE being treated like objects on trophies. They LIKE being stood up and they LIKE guys who don't call.

Women who are reading this are furious right now. You want to downvote me into oblivion. Fine. Do what you must. But if you are honest with yourself you will see that you are just as guilty of this as every other woman on the planet

I will never be the asshole boyfriend. But I definitely have become a bit more bastardly, a bit more jaded, and allot more cynical.

I was a Nice Guy once...


Glowin_Orb: Ok, perhaps you were not reading what I said. I pointed out that I was not behaving the way I was to get women. I acted as I did because it was WHO I WAS. However, as I stated above, I am sick and fucking tired of being bitched to when the type of guy women say they want to date abounds. We are not hard to come by, assholes are less common, yet women seek them out.
Oh, and I am very well aware that this will be nuked into oblivion. I don't care.

Eve007 pointed out in "I am a woman who does not like assholes" which is clearly a rebuttal to this one that not all women are as I describe. Of this I am aware, but the vast majority are. Eve007 is clearly a self-aware and down-to-earth woman who knows what she will and won't put up with. Great! Now if she could teach all the other women out there to be the same way.


I'm certain that the above wu will rest in oblivion soon, but let me clear this up anyway...

Women (and I'm talking about heterosexual women here. As a heterosexual man, I've had very little contact with gay women, so I don't know what goes on there) like men. You know why you so-called nice guys are having such problems? Because either:

A) You're trying too hard. You think that women want someone who is sensitive, polite, forgiving, tolerant, and empathetic. Here's the thing... They do, but they also want you to be a man. Your own man. Reverse the sterotype for a second. Would you want a woman who did nothing but act or try to act the way she thought you wanted her to? Would you want a woman who never told you that you were wrong, who never made a joke at your expense, who never sent you off cycling/drinking/whatever for the day because she wanted some time apart from your sorry ass? No (at least I hope not). Some of the things that make a woman great are not what you would call nice. See what I mean? Be yourself. Be a man. Be a good man (keep the ego in check, keep the testosterone in check, listen, love, etc.), but be a man. Be yourself. Quit worrying so much about what women want. They'll tell you if you listen.

B) You're hiding behind the "nice guy" label. You say the reason women aren't catching your vibe is because you're too nice. Might it have something to do with the fact that you haven't showered in a week? Maybe the last time you broke a sweat was when you ran to the store when EverQuest came out? Maybe your hair looks like a pile of crap? Can you talk about something besides multidimensional arrays and flaws in TCP/IP? See what I mean? It may not be that you are too nice (though that can be a problem). It may be that you're not doing the best you can with what you have.

Don't get me wrong. There is nothing wrong with being nice. I will even be nice when the occasion warrants it. However, if that's all you got and you're trying to work it, you're in trouble. Of course women aren't going to dig you. You know why? Because even more than women like men, they like people. And a person who's sole quality is that he can act excessively nice and pander to his own idea of what he thinks someone wants is not a very attractive person.

Until I got into traffic with you bastards.

Until I realized that smiling and letting someone go ahead of you only means that they'll get there first and take what you wanted.

Until I lost that youthful idealism and inched ever closer to cynicism.

Until I realized that not being a nice guy does not mean being an asshole.

I used to suffer from Nice Guy Syndrome. The symptoms of this disease are footprints on your back from where people have walked on you, and sexual frustration because women only want to be your friend.

I've never had a particularly submissive personality, nor did I gain any sort of sick masochistic pleasure from being fucked over, but I've always tried to be courteous and thoughtful in almost every facet of my life. A lot of people see this as a weakness, even if they don't consciously recognize this, and they exploit it. Being a nice guy, I would just turn the other cheek and get on with my life.

Being a wishy-washy little geek doesn't often attract members of the opposite sex. I've heard these Nice Guys (myself included, when I was one) constantly chant the same mantra: Women love assholes. Well I've discovered that this is not necessarily the case. You're always going to have people who run back to people who treat them like shit. But for the most part, women - and men for that matter (this is a blanket statement I know - but bear with me) aren't attracted to Assholes, per se, but rather to stronger seeming people who are less apt to take shit from people. (See: The Bastard Theory)

Being someone on the opposite end of that scale, I saw them as assholes.

So I whined about it. (Yeah, that's a great way to make yourself more attractive).

Well, there was no great epiphany. The lightbulb never went off, and there was never one point in time to which I can point and say, "That's when I stopped being A Nice Guy." But gradually as I learned how to better deal with people, especially in a very carnivorous work environment, and get what I wanted either through diplomacy or through force, I gradually realized - hey, I'm still a nice guy - I get along with people, and I smile a lot - but I'm not a Nice Guy.

I haven't heard "I like you as a friend" in several years.

The last time I did hear that, my reply was "Thanks, but I have enough friends," and I walked away. Twenty minutes later, she came by and asked for my phone number.

After we talked for a while, she told me that she thought I was nice. And do you know something?

It didn't bother me a bit.

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